Think about a cherished one brutally murdered abroad — allegedly by one other American.

The Red Tea Detox

Correspondent Peter Van Sant and his workforce have investigated the disturbing 1988 homicide of Carolyn Abel, an American trainer in South Korea, and the loophole in U.S. legal guidelines on the time that imply the suspected killer might by no means face trial.


For author and creator Nancy Bercaw, flying to South Korea final winter reopened a painful chapter in her life: one in all homicide, loss and worry.

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Nancy Bercaw: Not solely have been we devastated in regards to the lack of Carolyn … We after all questioned, “Who’s subsequent?”

Peter Van Sant: Again in Seoul. The place needs to be our first cease?

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Nancy Bercaw:  Effectively, I believe we should always go to the college, to ELS, the place all of us taught.

ELS is the English Language Faculty, the place Bercaw met fellow trainer Carolyn Abel again in 1988.

Nancy Bercaw: That is the college. …And the world was by no means the identical for any of us who have been in that constructing collectively on December 20th.

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The occasions of that day have haunted Carolyn Abel’s household for 30 years. 

Wanda Abel:  And the harm that is been executed … was simply so devastating.

Wanda Abel remembers her youthful sister Carolyn as the middle or consideration from an early age.

“That is our very first passport picture. Carolyn is on the correct,” stated Wanda Abel, who’s pictured along with her sisters.

CBS Information/Wanda Abel

Wanda Abel: She was the youngest and the cutest and … the newborn of the household.

The youngest daughter of professors Dr. Francis and Evelyn Abel, Carolyn had a love of pictures and a wanderlust that took her world wide.

Wanda Abel: My mom stated on reflection it was nearly like she knew she did not have lots of time … she needed to do as a lot as she might within the time she had, and never waste a second.

By the point she graduated from school, Carolyn had already lived in Pakistan, East Asia, Germany and France.

Wanda Abel: She would get stressed. She did not like being simply in a single place for too lengthy.

That restlessness compelled Carolyn to affix the Peace Corps after school, serving in Nepal the place she taught English. In 1987, Carolyn took one other educating job in Japan, the place she met Tomoyuki Ayagaki, a customs agent. 

Tomoyuki Ayagaki [translated]: She’s at all times — cheerful.

Peter Van Sant: Did she make you snicker?

Tomoyuki Ayagaki:  Sure, she’s humorous.

Carolyn and Ayagaki started a relationship that in a short time turned critical.

Peter Van Sant: Did you fall in love with Carolyn?

Tomoyuki Ayagaki: Oh, sure.

Wanda Abel: Tomoyuki did suggest to Carolyn.

Peter Van Sant: And what was her reply? Have you learnt?

Wanda Abel: Carolyn … was making an attempt to resolve whether or not she could be completely satisfied being married and staying in Japan.

Whereas considering a future life with Ayagaki, Carolyn acquired a proposal for an additional job 330 miles away and throughout the Sea of Japan.

Within the fall of 1988, Carolyn set out on her subsequent journey in life, educating English in Seoul, South Korea.

Carolyn Abel

Wanda Abel

Nancy Bercaw: And from the minute she walked into the workers room, she was only a breath of contemporary air. …She form of regarded a little bit bit like Farrah Fawcett.

That is the place Carolyn rapidly fell in with Nancy Bercaw and the opposite American lecturers in school. Like Sandra Ames, who requested that we alter her present look for this interview.

Sandra Ames: She was making her college students snicker, and sing, and — and have enjoyable studying English.

And Tamara Doak.

Tamara Doak: She made mates with all people. She was very, very pleasant.                                                                                                  
Carolyn additionally hit it off with the top trainer on the faculty, Kathy Patrick.

Sandra Ames: Carolyn and Kathy Patrick have been extraordinarily good mates. …They have been thought of, if I can use a contemporary time period, besties.

The ladies taught, traveled and partied collectively.

Nancy Bercaw: Ex-pat life in Seoul within the late ’80s was wild and … one place the place our worlds collided and that was Itaewon, the red-light district. … So, what we did is we danced and drank like loopy folks.

On the weekend of Dec. 17, 1988, simply three days earlier than the homicide, Ames, Patrick, Carolyn and a few Korean college students took a visit into the mountains. Carolyn took footage.

Sandra Ames: We spent the time taking a look at temples, and climbing after which partying within the evenings.

Lessons have been winding down for the winter break. Ayagaki was on the point of fly to Seoul, hoping to get a solution to his marriage proposal. On Tuesday, Dec. 20, Carolyn by no means made it to work. 

Nancy Bercaw: And lots of us … missed work from time to time for varied causes.

Sandra Ames: I used to be not at that time involved. However … Kathy was involved about Carolyn as a result of she could not get her on the cellphone.

Kathy Patrick was the top trainer on the English Language Faculty in Seoul when Carolyn Abel arrived to show there 

Wanda Abel

Nancy Bercaw: Kathy was asking all of us — had any of us heard from Carolyn. … No.

Sandra Ames: Kathy was very upset, satisfied that one thing had occurred to Carolyn.

Tamara Doak: And — I stated, “Effectively … possibly we should always go over there.”

Sandra Aes:  At that time, a few of our college students drove us to Carolyn’s condominium. We went into the condominium, and Kathy … found the physique … She was murdered brutally and horribly and in a means she didn’t deserve.

Tamara Doak: And we have been simply all in shock. … simply making an attempt to determine … what occurred.

Nancy Bercaw:  I believe all of us simply felt like, “What the hell’s gonna occur now? Are we in peril? How will Sandra and Kathy ever get well from the shock of seeing their lifeless buddy? The place will we go from right here?” 


PETER VAN SANT [outside Carolyn’s apartment building]: Carolyn’s condominium was on the 15th ground. So right here we’re.

PETER VAN SANT [ knocks on door, speaks to man in Carolyn’s old apartment]: I am Peter Van Sant. And I am a reporter for CBS Information and we’re engaged on a narrative a couple of girl named Carolyn who used to reside in your condominium. … and we got here by to ask you … if we might have permission … to return into your condominium to take some video footage.

“48 Hours” visits American homicide sufferer’s Seoul condominium

Early within the afternoon on Dec. 20, 1988, colleagues and college students of Carolyn Abel’s got here to her condominium constructing after she failed to point out up for work. 

Kathy Patrick, Sandra Ames and three Korean males walked down the out of doors hallway. Surprisingly, the door was unlocked they usually went inside.

Peter Van Sant: Who was the primary particular person into the condominium?  

Sandra Ames:  Kathy … She went — did a B-line proper to the bed room.  … Kathy got here out of the room and stated, “Carolyn’s lifeless. We have to name an ambulance. No, we have to name the cops.” And he or she did not need me to go have a look at the physique.

Carolyn Abel put up a combat in her final minutes of life. She had numerous defensive wounds. And he or she took the brunt of it. Greater than 30 stab wounds together with a lower — from ear to ear on the– on the throat. And there was blood in every single place in right here. On the partitions, on the mattress. It was a multitude.

Korean police and press swarmed Carolyn’s condominium, which had been ransacked.

U.S. Military CID

Korean police and press swarmed the condominium, which had been ransacked. Inside hours, the homicide led the nationwide information in South Korea.         

Tamara Doak: And I bear in mind watching the information and the cameras panning across the room. They usually stored, you understand, entering into on this teddy bear … And it was actually horrible.

Nancy Bercaw: The impression of seeing her physique wheeled out in a physique bag actually made it fairly actual … it wasn’t a dream. It turned the nightmare that it actually nonetheless is to this present day.

Peter Van Sant: How did you get the information of what had occurred to your sister?

Wanda Abel:  I used to be at residence. … And my mom known as me … she informed me that Carolyn had been murdered. And I simply — I screamed … We’re simply — crying … making an attempt to determine, I imply, how might this occur? Who would wanna do that to her? Everyone cherished Carolyn. Why?

With the killer nonetheless on the market, Carolyn’s mates questioned … might they be subsequent?

Nancy Bercaw: We have been all sure that … maybe a Korean … had in all probability killed her. … if a Korean hated an American this a lot, was he coming after the remainder of us?

The shocked mates turned their consideration to Kathy Patrick and Sandra Ames, who had found Carolyn’s physique.

Tamara Doak:  They appeared horrified. … I used to be so involved about them.

Nancy Bercaw: They have been hysterical. … it appeared as in the event that they have been having a nervous breakdown.                                        

Days later, Patrick led a memorial service for Carolyn.  

Nancy Bercaw [emotional]: And I believe it was fairly transferring.

Peter Van Sant: Even now occupied with it, you tear up a bit.  

Patrick additionally wrote to Carolyn’s mother and father. Wanda Abel nonetheless has that letter.

Wanda Abel [reading]: “Please know that I cherished Carolyn as a sister and an expensive buddy. … My roommate and are I the 2 individuals who discovered Carolyn in her condominium. Let me know if I can let you know something.”

In Japan, Tomoyuki Ayagaki realized the love of his life with was gone. However he determined to make his journey to South Korea anyway. He stayed with Patrick and Ames.

Peter Van Sant: Even in the present day in any case these years, 30 years, this nonetheless will get to you, does not it?

Tomoyuki Ayagaki: Yeah [wipes away a tear]. Sorry.

In Seoul, rumors have been swirling and South Korean police solid a large web.

Nancy Bercaw: We have been all suspects. … Each single trainer on the workers was interviewed. … And, you understand, the Korean police have been in our faces identical to, “The place have been you? How do you know Carolyn? What’s your story? Why are you right here? Why did you come into our nation? Are you secretly FBI?” … We simply stored considering, “Why are you asking me this? Get on the market and discover the actual killer.”

Then, Bercaw took a cellphone name within the lecturers’ lounge that moved the investigation in a complete new route.

Nancy Bercaw: It gave the impression of a Korean girl. … After which in a short time, she stated, “I do know who killed Carolyn.” I stated, “What?” … She stated, “An American navy officer.”

Bercaw informed the South Korean police, who introduced in detectives from the U.S. Military.

Nancy Bercaw: And really rapidly thereafter John Boatwright walked in.

John Boatwright was a legendary chief of detectives for the Military’s Felony Investigation Division in South Korea. He rapidly eradicated the U.S. navy officer who was pegged as a suspect by his ex-girlfriend.

John Boatwright: He didn’t know Carolyn Abel. … And it appeared that she was simply making an attempt to get revenge on him for the dangerous breakup.

Three weeks after the homicide, an post-mortem revealed the reason for demise: a stab wound to her proper lung. The report additionally confirmed her throat was lower.

John Boatwright: For my part, her throat was lower after she was deceased.

Peter Van Sant: After? How uncommon is that primarily based in your expertise?

John Boatwright: Very uncommon.

John Boatwright was a legendary chief of detectives for the Military’s Felony Investigation Division in South Korea. He rapidly eradicated the U.S. navy officer who was pegged as a suspect by his ex-girlfriend.

John Boatwright

So, what did occur at Carolyn’s condominium?

John Boatwright: I used to be satisfied that … whoever did this in all probability knew Carolyn.          

Peter Van Sant: Why? 

John Boatwright: As a result of there was no indicators of pressured entry into the condominium. … It appeared that whoever was in that condominium knew her.       

Peter Van Sant: There have been two espresso cups discovered within the room. … If there is a break-in, typically, a felony wouldn’t say, “Hey, let’s — let’s have a cup of espresso earlier than I ransack your home and assault you.”

John Boatwright: That definitely wouldn’t be regular.

Like his South Korean counterparts, Boatwright determined to query Carolyn’s colleagues, who informed him:

John Boatwright: You actually ought to have a look at the 2 women who discovered the physique.

These two girls? Sandra Ames and Kathy Patrick.

Nancy Bercaw: We assumed {that a} Korean had in all probability killed her. …However little did we all know that the enemy was inside that workers room with us.


Simply weeks after Carolyn Abel’s homicide, the investigation by John Boatwright was specializing in the 2 mates who had found her physique: roommates Kathy Patrick and Sandra Ames.

Peter Van Sant: And do you get an opportunity to query every of them?

John Boatwright: No. Kathy Patrick had already gotten on a airplane and left Korea.

Nancy Bercaw: We had inspired her to go. She should have misplaced 15 kilos … She simply regarded like somebody who was about to interrupt.

Kathy Patrick, left, and Sandra Ames

Patrick returned residence to Washington state, however Ames was nonetheless in Seoul.

John Boatwright: I took a press release from her … After which, I ask her, “Did you kill Carolyn? And … She simply, form of, sat there and stared at me. 

Peter Van Sant: She’s simply gazing you?

John Boatwright: That is appropriate. … After about 30 seconds, she was very quiet, however she stated, “No.” … That was simply — simply not regular.

Ames maintains she had nothing to cover. So, two months after the homicide, she waived her proper to an lawyer and agreed to take a lie detector check.

Sandra Ames: I bear in mind … being hooked as much as all of the wires in a darkened room.

John Boatwright: He requested her, “Have you learnt the place the homicide weapon is?” And he or she stated, “No.” And he or she actually peaked out on that … indicating … she was not being truthful.

Sandra Ames: I stated, “I am not mendacity. I am telling the reality.” … So we took it once more with the identical outcomes. And at that time I stated, “Let me let you know about this image in my head.” … The image was a darkish form on a mattress coated in a quilt that I knew was a physique.  

Ames described that image in her head as a fragmented reminiscence of that evening. As Boatwright requested her for extra particulars, she informed a brand new story. It was nothing wanting a bombshell.

Sandra Ames: The story started with being in mattress, and having Kathy on the door of my room, and coming in and saying, “I believe I killed Carolyn.” “What with?” I requested. And he or she stated, “A knife.” “The place is it?” I requested. “Within the kitchen sink.”

Ames stated she was in disbelief, and requested Patrick to take her to Carolyn’s condominium the place she noticed her buddy’s brutalized physique on the mattress, coated in blood.

Sandra Ames: To one of the best of my recollection, we sat in the lounge at Carolyn’s condominium, and … she satisfied me, manipulated me, to assist her make it appear to be a theft.

Although she did not point out it after we spoke along with her, Boatwright says that in their interview, Sandra made one other assertion about her personal actions that evening after she walked in and noticed Carolyn’s physique.

John Boatwright:  She says, “I touched her arm and it was heat. And at that time, I spotted that she could also be nonetheless alive and that she may testify towards … Kathy. And so I went to the kitchen, obtained a knife, and got here again, and I lower her throat to ensure she was lifeless.”

Keep in mind, Boatwright believed that wound was inflicted after Carolyn was already lifeless from the stab wound to the lung.

Peter Van Sant: So what Sandra is telling you is definitely forensically matching up w — what was executed to Carolyn’s physique?

John Boatwright: Completely.

However Sandra Ames’ story rapidly modified. In official statements, Ames wrote that Kathy Patrick had admitted to chopping Carolyn’s throat. And in the present day Ames claims that the one cause she made that admission was as a result of “false recollections” implanted by investigators. However she does not deny going to the crime scene or dealing with the homicide weapon.

Peter Van Sant: You probably did inform authorities on the time that you simply cleaned a bloody knife.

Sandra Ames: I did. I did, and that was as a result of — I remembered placing the clear knife into the dish rack … Kathy had stated that that was the knife she had used to kill Carolyn.

It could appear far-fetched, however Ames claims these recollections had been suppressed deep in her unconscious thoughts till the interview with Boatwright.

Peter Van Sant: Are you telling me the reality?

Sandra Ames: Sure. Sure.

Peter Van Sant: As a result of a few of these lapses in reminiscence are type of handy.

Sandra Ames: Oh, they’re very handy. … However no, that is the reality as I lived it.

Although Ames’ story was weird to say the least, investigators believed the core particulars, which by no means modified: that Patrick woke her up and confessed to killing Carolyn, and the 2 of them staged it to appear to be a theft. And the proof they collected, appeared to again that up.

John Boatwright: Every time that she was interviewed later, she stored altering the info to — to restrict her involvement within the homicide. However she by no means denied that Kathy did the homicide. And he or she by no means denied that she was current simply after the homicide.

Peter Van Sant: Who do you consider held the knife and murdered Carolyn Abel?

John Boatwright: Kathy Patrick.

After her confession, Sandra Ames was stored in home arrest in Seoul. 5 months later, in July 1989, she pleaded responsible to harboring a felony and suppressing proof.

Sandra Ames: I used to be fingerprinted, photographed and put right into a holding cell.

However why would Patrick need Carolyn lifeless? Investigators uncovered a secret which offered a possible motive.

Tamara Doak: Kathy actually fell for Carolyn.

Tamara Doak was one of many few lecturers who knew Kathy was homosexual.

Tamara Doak: And he or she would open up to me, you understand, “I actually like this girl. … I believe she’s into me.” And I am like, “Kathy, I do not actually suppose she’s homosexual. You need to actually watch out.”

Sandra Ames: Kathy informed me that she was in love with Carolyn … and that … her emotions weren’t essentially returned.

John Boatwright: I consider that — Kathy and Carolyn have been alone — throughout that preliminary assault. … The factor that makes essentially the most sense to me is … Kathy tried to kiss Carolyn and Carolyn pushed her away and rejected that kiss. … I believe Kathy was so enraged and offended that she misplaced management.

Kathy Patrick was now the prime suspect in Carolyn Abel’s homicide. A homicide warrant for her arrest was issued in South Korea. Again in Japan, Carolyn’s boyfriend, Tomoyuki Ayagaki, heard the information.

Peter Van Sant: You stayed with Kathy at her condominium.

Tomoyuki Ayagaki: Aside– sure. … [via interpreter] It was an enormous shock … if that is true, if I stayed within the residence of the — of the assassin, I — I really feel horrible.

Kathy Patrick
Kathy Patrick was now the prime suspect in Carolyn Abel’s homicide.

Tamara Doak

For her half within the alleged crimes, Sandra Ames was sentenced to 1 yr in jail.  In the meantime, Kathy Patrick was again at residence in Washington state. The South Korean authorities made diplomatic requests to return her to Seoul from the U.S. to face a homicide cost, however hit a wall.

John Boatwright: There was no extradition treaty with Korea on the time.

Tamara Doak: As soon as she left … they could not get her again there.

Nancy Bercaw: Why could not we see by way of Kathy and Sandra?  It is simply – unreal. You already know, in a single fell swoop, you be taught that your folks are concerned on this crime … And that the one who may need been the killer is free. … due to this loophole in American regulation.

Within the States, Carolyn’s household pushed for an arrest.

Wanda Abel: The U.S. lawyer in Washington state stated, “No, you possibly can’t arrest her as a result of she hasn’t dedicated a criminal offense in the USA.” …there was no jurisdiction to arrest her for homicide … And that is what pushed my household to say, “Wait a minute. This is not proper.”

However American authorities weren’t completed with Kathy Patrick. And shortly, they might come face-to-face along with her.

Peter Van Sant: Did you ask Kathy Patrick flat-out, “Did you homicide Carolyn Abel?”

Steven Schroeder: Sure, I did.


Within the days after Carolyn’s homicide, Wanda Abel labored time beyond regulation through the holidays to carry her residence.

Wanda Abel: We obtained her again in time to carry the funeral on New 12 months’s Eve.

Gone however by no means forgotten. Wanda Abel and her household have been pushing the federal government to pursue a case towards Kathy Patrick, who had left South Korea simply weeks after Carolyn’s homicide.

Wanda Abel holds one of many final footage taken of her sister, Carolyn.

CBS Information/Wanda Abel

Peter Van Sant: So, do you consider this sudden transfer from South Korea to the USA was in a way– an expression of consciousness of guilt?

Wanda Abel: Sure. … Kathy knew she did it, so she needed to suspect that in the end someone was going to place it collectively or that Sandra was going to crack and inform on her. … So she spends as little time in South Korea as potential after she killed Carolyn.

With Kathy Patrick again in Washington State, Carolyn Abel’s household was fearful they could possibly be focused.


Wanda Abel: I used to be anxious that Kathy would attempt to kill us, as a result of Kathy wrote these letters to my mother and father that she was her nice buddy and that … she’d love to satisfy them. … and I used to be working by way of my thoughts, “What would I do if I noticed this particular person or if she confirmed up at my home?”

Regardless of the dearth of an extradition treaty, there was nonetheless that South Korean arrest warrant for homicide for Kathy Patrick. In addition they requested the U.S. authorities for assist.

Steven Schroeder: My title is Steven Schroeder, I am a retired Assistant United States Lawyer and I labored in Seattle.

Peter Van Sant: What did the South Koreans need you to do?

Steven Schroeder:  Amongst different issues, they needed me to take a deposition of Kathy Patrick and ask her some questions in regards to the homicide that occurred in Seoul.

It was 1989 when Steven Schroeder was assigned the case with John Boatwright and FBI brokers. Alongside along with her lawyer, Kathy Patrick willingly sat down with them to be questioned.

Peter Van Sant: Did you ask Kathy Patrick flat-out, “Did you homicide Carolyn Abel?”

Steven Schroeder: Sure, I did.

Peter Van Sant: What did she say?

Steven Schroeder: She stated she didn’t.

Peter Van Sant: And did you current her with what her roommate had stated?

Steven Schroeder: Sure.

Peter Van Sant: And what did she say about that?

Steven Schroeder: Merely, it wasn’t true.

Peter Van Sant: And did Kathy attempt to shift blame in any respect? Did she level the finger of suspicion in any respect at Sandra?

Steven Schroeder: Not with me.

Patrick additionally denied, beneath oath, that she was in love with Carolyn Abel.

Peter Van Sant: Do you consider Kathy Patrick lied to you? 

Steven Schroeder: There was sufficient indication of that to justify us doing additional investigation, sure. … my technique at that time was if the Koreans didn’t prosecute her, then to look whether or not we might for mainly false statements, perjury, obstruction of justice.

Regardless that lie detector exams are inadmissible in federal court docket, they’re a instrument utilized by investigators to verify deception. Kathy Patrick willingly agreed to take one and reply questions on Carolyn’s homicide.

Steven Schroeder: The examiner concluded that she was misleading.

Peter Van Sant: And deception is –

Steven Schroeder:  Mendacity.

Peter Van Sant: Mendacity.

After the polygraph, Kathy Patrick — whom South Korea nonetheless needed to arrest for homicide — was free to depart and resume her life in Washington State.

Peter Van Sant: Is that irritating?

Steven Schroeder: It was very irritating.

Compounding Carolyn’s household’s grief, Sandra Ames was launched from a South Korean jail after serving simply six months of her one-year sentence — and it wasn’t due to good conduct.

Peter Van Sant: Is it true you bought out of jail as a result of somebody bribed a choose to get you out? 

Sandra Ames: Yep. Completely.

Wanda Abel: We simply could not consider it. I imply, six months for helping a assassin and protecting up the crime scene and making it appear to be a housebreaking and never even telling anyone? Not speaking? … I do not perceive.

When Ames returned to the USA, she was recruited by the FBI to go undercover and secretly document a reunion with Kathy Patrick in hopes of eliciting a confession.

Sandra Ames: I did not even name. I merely went to her home.   

Peter Van Sant: And what did she say to you? … “Sandra, what are you doing right here?” 

Sandra Ames: In all probability [laughs]. … And I believe I stated one thing alongside the traces of, “How might you’ve got executed that? How might you’ve got killed Carolyn?” … And he or she stated, “I do not know what you are speaking about.”

With out incriminating statements from Patrick, the Feds weren’t capable of press costs for perjury.

Peter Van Sant: So long as she stays inside these borders, she’s a free girl.   

Steven Schroeder: That is — that is appropriate, sure.

And with no extradition treaty in place, South Korean authorities put the homicide case on the shelf.

Wanda Abel: I believe the South Koreans have been taking the perspective that it is a U.S. drawback. It is two U.S. residents.

In the meantime, Carolyn’s household carried on with their quest for justice.

Wanda Abel:  My dad … contacting each congressman, each senator … He wrote to information stations – “60 Minutes” … ‘trigger he hoped that if that occurred, then there could be extra publicity, extra strain.

Whereas Kathy Patrick carried on along with her life.

Peter Van Sant Whether it is true that Kathy Patrick murdered your sister, is she a hazard in the present day to the general public? 

Wanda Abel: I believe she in all probability is. … And who is aware of what would set off some form — that type of violence once more?


For nearly three a long time, Kathy Patrick has a lived a quiet life in Bellingham, Washington, situated north of Seattle, the place for the final 18 years, she has labored as a pupil advisor at Western Washington College.

Patrick turned down “48 Hours”‘ request for an interview, saying Carolyn’s homicide was too painful to speak about. However on this present day, her previous was quick approaching.

Peter Van Sant [walking outside]: We’re gonna make our transfer now to Kathy Patrick’s workplace.

Peter Van Sant: Hello, Kathy Patrick?

Kathy Patrick: Hello.

Peter Van Sant: Hello. Peter Van Sant, with CBS Information. … There are investigators from two nations that … are sure that you simply murdered Carolyn Abel, what do you must say? 

Kathy Patrick: Umm, I’ve to say that I am harmless. And that I — do not know what occurred after I discovered Carolyn’s physique.

Kathy Patrick and “48 Hours” correspondent Peter Van Sant

CBS Information

These are Kathy Patrick’s first public phrases on the homicide of Carolyn Abel in 30 years.

Peter Van Sant: Now your roommate says simply the other. That you just confessed to her, and that the 2 of you then went again over to Carolyn’s condominium and staged the scene as a housebreaking.

Kathy Patrick: No.

Peter Van Sant: That by no means occurred?

Kathy Patrick: No.  

Peter Van Sant: So she is mendacity to us when she informed us that?  

Kathy Patrick: I consider she is.

Peter Van Sant: You flunked a polygraph check … how did that occur?

Kathy Patrick: I do not know the science of polygraphs, I am not stunned that I’d, um, flunk it on reflection given how clammy and nervous I’m proper now and I’m even shaking. It was a daunting expertise and I completely have no idea what occurred earlier than I went to her condominium and located her physique. Please sit.

Peter Van Sant: It has been 30 years since this –

Peter Van Sant: Is not it time to return clear about this? Investigators are sure that you simply dedicated this homicide

Kathy Patrick: They’re incorrect. 

Peter Van Sant: Should you did not who did?

Kathy Patrick: I consider it should have been … Ames.  

Peter Van Sant: Sandra Ames? … She says you probably did it, and also you had her go over and assist manipulate the room to make it appear to be a housebreaking.

Kathy Patrick: That is not true.

Peter Van Sant: One other circumstance in all of that is that –

Kathy Patrick: Um, can we cease proper now?

Peter Van Sant: These are vital inquiries to be requested about this. There have been 30 stab wounds on Carolyn’s physique and mates say that you simply attacked her after she rejected you –

Kathy Patrick [emphatic]: No.

Peter Van Sant: — your romantic advances.

Kathy Patrick: No! This has to cease now, please. … You are actually sidelining me right here, and I’m not ready to reply questions right here at my place of job. This occurred 30 years in the past, I’ve been accessible to investigators in Korea and within the U.S.

In her interviews with South Korean police, a deposition and a polygraph check with American investigators, Kathy Patrick didn’t level a finger at Sandra Ames. Steven Schroeder had a query about that for Patrick.

Steven Schroeder: Effectively, why did not you inform us that 29 years in the past?

When “48 Hours” lately contacted Sandra Ames, she informed us she wasn’t “stunned” that Kathy Patrick tried responsible her and denied having participated in Carolyn’s homicide. 

Sandra Ames: If it went to trial, I’d be keen to testify. I’d want to testify.

Peter Van Sant: The place ought to Kathy Patrick be in the present day, in your opinion?

Wanda Abel: She needs to be in jail. Plain and easy.

Due to the Abel household’s lobbying efforts, in 1994 Congress handed a regulation that enables for the U.S. prosecution of U.S. nationals who kill different Individuals in overseas nations. 

Steven Schroeder: And so, in the present day, American households — if their family members are murdered overseas by an American — can have a really totally different expertise than Carolyn Abel’s household did. And I believe — I believe all of us owe them a debt of gratitude.

However in Carolyn Abel’s case, any trial appears extremely unlikely. In South Korea, the statute of limitations for her homicide has expired. And the Abel household says investigators informed them the bodily proof within the case has been destroyed — proof that may’ve been essential for a trial in the USA.

Wanda Abel: Nobody ought to should undergo what my household went by way of. How … will we reside in a world … the place a U.S. citizen and go and homicide a U.S. citizen, after which come again and reside like nothing occurred? That is the outrage of this.

In a case the place nothing is straightforward, the lengthy path to justice might by no means attain its vacation spot.

Wanda Abel: I truthfully cannot image her outdated ‘trigger she was simply at all times so — so vibrant and so energetic. And I – I — I believe she nonetheless could be. … you understand, I miss her. She was like my greatest buddy.

Nancy Bercaw:  We have all continued our lives as adventurous folks. …However, you understand, we type of … carry the reminiscence of Carolyn … behind us, no matter floor we stroll on. It is arduous to not bear in mind there’s one other one in all us who could possibly be on the market on the identical path.

The regulation that Carolyn Abel’s household helped go has led to 3 profitable homicide prosecutions.


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